Forum - View topicSatoshi Kon has scarred me for life....
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Gewürtztraminer
 Posts: 1028 Location: Texas - Its like whole other country. |
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Gotta throw in here.
There is a thread titled the most disturbing scene in anime, and I have been tempted to post about the "rape" scene in perfect blue. The scene is fake, they stop to reposition cameras, and the actor apologizes to Mimi, even with the absurdness a very powerful and surreal scene. But, the destruction of Mimi's pop idol persona, and Rumi's reaction is a real rape of a non sexual nature. It stuck with we me a long time. Shinkai has nailed the seperation, longing vibe, Kon with Perfect Blue, Paranoi Agent, and Millenium Actress, has a lot to say about reality vs dreams. As a side note, I thought Bridgette Hoffman nailed Mimi in the dub. I will always associate "Excuse me, who are you?" with this film. |
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fullmetal biologist
 Posts: 61 Location: north carolina, usa |
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That is what I really like about Kon's work too. His characters are far from beautiful, idealized superkids. Paprika also had an overweight, socially awkward engineer as one of the protagonists. And while I am not sure he is trying to scar us all for life, he doesn't sugarcute the dark side of society and the strange and wonderful experiences that can exist along with the scary and disturbing. I consider his works to be just like other movies or television shows aimed at older teens or adults. The sexual situations are part of the complicated interactions that underlie his world and as rinmackie mentioned, not for titillation. Having said that, the episode of Paranoia Agent , Happy Family Planning, spoiler[featuring three characters repeatedly trying to kill themselves ] really messed me up. |
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sanosuke32
Posts: 454 |
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agreed with what you just said. Especially that Paranoia agent episode, so weird. It was funny, but at the same time, kinda scary. I like spoiler[ trying to figure out why they all tried to kill themselves in the first place, and why the episode is called that, and when they all died, because if you look closely, they do have shadows at the beginning. ] |
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fullmetal biologist
Posts: 61 Location: north carolina, usa |
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Sanosuke32, in regards to Paranoia Agent, spoiler[thanks for pointing that out about the shadows. I need to watch it that episode again, because there are several clues to what is going on, including the photo taken of the trio. Did you see the flash of the vending machine showing the condoms with the "happy family planning" ad? I am not sure how this and the suicides fit together, but ]Kon always makes us think about the absurd and the strange as well as life and death.
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sanosuke32
Posts: 454 |
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ya exactly, spoiler[I imagine that when they took the picture, they saw them as ghosts or something, and that vending machine, I think that the little girl wants to commit suicide because she was a mistake or something along those lines. And the old guy, that one piece of paper he's holding is the reason for him, I believe he's in debt or something close to that. As for the other guy, I can't remember when I decided and read, I remember one theory was he was gay, something bout his locket, him and his gay lover or something like that. It's been a long time since I watched it last, I'll probably watch it again soon though] Long ass spoiler tag there, lol. |
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Fear Ghoul
 Posts: 65 |
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I personally am a huge fan of Satoshi Kon's works, and own everything he has done except Paranoia Agent (which I have seen anyway). What particularly impresses me with his films is the manner in which he can take a normal scenario and transform it into an engaging and submersive work of art that blends believable and emotionally complex characters with an engaging plot in a contemporary setting that reflects human society. In Perfect Blue, we see the effects of superstardom and the drastic measures taken to achieve success which compromises integrity, while Tokyo Godfathers is all about homelessness related to people's disconnection from their family and their salvation when they find their old families or new ones. I admire Satoshi Kon's work so much that I'm a guaranteed customer if something has his name attached as director.
I never felt that the material in Perfect Blue was particularly disturbing, especially not compared to Ninja Scroll, another one of my favourite films. The filmed rape scene in Perfect Blue wasn't really a rape scene, and the stalker's attempted rape wasn't any different from what occurs in nearly every anime that has sexual assault. Ninja Scroll's genuine rape scene was far more disturbing for me, and nearly put me off it the first time watching, and is still in my opinion one of the few faults with the film. I find it interesting that you are more disturbed by the reality of Perfect Blue than the fantasy of Ninja Scroll or Elfen Lied. Seems like there might be some issues you have with reality there. On a side note, I do have a friend who was given nightmare's by Perfect Blue. By the same token thought this guy thinks Silence of the Lambs might be too scary and gory even though he loves CSI, and that one episode of Cowboy Bebop is enough heavy material for an evening. Therefore, I am inclined to give it a pinch of salt. Certainly no one should be put off Perfect Blue simply because one or two people found it disturbing. Just be aware that there is some full nudity and some violence, and never do the two actually meet. That's all. |
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sanosuke32
Posts: 454 |
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Ya, thats the only two things to be aware of. Disturbing is a good thing btw, if you don't find satoshi kons works disturbing then you're messed. Disturbing is the reason i watch his films and Paranoia Agent.
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Fear Ghoul
Posts: 65 |
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On the other hand being disturbed by Perfect Blue could be indicative of living too sheltered a life from the reality of the world. There is nothing in Perfect Blue you wouldn't find in a decent thriller. Meanwhile sexual assaults occur regularly in anime and no one blinks an eye? Oh and lets not forget the famous Shinji and Asuka scene in EOE... I do refuse to watch Ichi the Killer and Wicked City, based entirely on the words "sexual violence" contained in the descriptions of these anime. So I still have my boundaries, with Ninja Scroll being on the very edge in one scene, and Perfect Blue nestling comfortably within. |
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TheVok
Posts: 613 Location: North York, Ontario, Canada |
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I fully understand that not all types of content are suitable for all types of viewers, but to me, context is everything. There are excellent movies and series that contain sexual violence; there are also horrible movies and series that contain sexual violence. Some are art; some are exploitation.
Quality deserving of viewers' attention is not really a question of content in such literal terms; it's more a question of contextual use of such content. When Satoshi Kon's movies disturb viewers in ways they don't like, it may be an example of how fans take on 'anime' as a whole field of entertainment, rather than picking and choosing works on their own merit. Don't get me wrong, there's a first time for everything and I'd rather folks keep an open mind about trying new things, but if you've gotten the impression Satoshi Kon's movies will rub you the wrong way, you don't have to see them just because they're anime ... nor even just because he's also been hailed as a cinematic genius. |
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sanosuke32
Posts: 454 |
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Thats not disturbing, Ichi the Killer is not near as disturbing as Paranoia Agent. Disturbing is when something happens that makes you think about it and try to piece things together, and the things that happen just make it all disturbing. I've never met a person who doesn't think Satoshi Kon's works are disturbing, thats one of the only reasons people love him. And whats with people on all forums loving to say that they aren't sheltered. You just have to add that in somewhere. Sure there's pointless wars and all that crap, but reality and movies are two very different things, i wouldn't even call real life stuff disturbing, I'd say more pathetic. |
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Fear Ghoul
Posts: 65 |
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Ichi the Killer has real physical torture and violence, including a scene where a character pleasures himself over a bunch of dead rabbits (or so my friend who has watched it told me). What about that isn't uncomfortable and disturbing?
You are confusing disturbing with provocative and introspective.
People love him for telling a good story. Otherwise Millennium Actress and Tokyo Godfathers would have been failures because they contain no content capable of disturbing anyone.
Art imitates life, and life imitates art. If real life doesn't disturb you, then nothing in fiction ever should (emphasis on should, because there will be exceptions). I didn't mean to give the impression that I'm not sheltered, because anyone brought up in at least a decent environment is sheltered. However there are extents to which people are too sheltered, such that even an iota of evidence suggesting the world isn't the way they think is too shattering a blow for them, so they retreat into their own little reality. The original point of my comment was that someone was far more disturbed by the reality of Perfect Blue (which many up and coming actresses have to go through by the way) than the far more genuinely violent Ninja Scroll and Elfen Leid, a show famous for its gratuitous sexual violence. If something more physically tame but indicative of real life such as Perfect Blue is more disturbing than either Ninja Scroll or Elfen Lied then that suggests a problem with reality, perhaps due to a more sheltered existence from the evils of the world. It's not a bad thing, just unfortunate. Ignorance is bliss and knowledge is power, but knowledge is also corruption. |
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