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archangelunder7 wrote:

An R rating would be an unrealistic expectation.

Think about it; we're talking about a show about a 14 year old girl in a fluffy pink dress who uses magic to fight witches...

Actually, we're talking about a cosmic horror story with a heroine who is unsure of her place in things and another heroine who risks everything by making a Faustian bargain to save the person they love.

archangelunder7 wrote:

Setting aside that not being the key focus of the show itself, it's the most obvious image associated with Madoka Magica.

Now, lets say I'm an every day movie goer, at the cinema wanting to see a movie. My choices are Wolverine 3- with lots of grunting, sweating, adamantium claws and a token good looking female actress who probably wears tight leather...

Or...

Something that (lets be honest) at first glance looks like Hanna Montanna in the land of Strawberry Shortcake... Rated R.

I think it would be a easier sell to change the wardrobe design than to change the whole story so it would appeal more to kids based on Madoka's wardrobe.

I'm not sure what a PG-version of it would look like: Ordinary middle-schooler Maia Connelly(making up Western names for the characters) is asked by QB, a talking weasel to become a magical girl and fight evil witches. For some mysterious reason, dark-haired transfer student Hermoine Ackerson tries to stop her...

archangelunder7 wrote:

Result: no one who hasn't already seen Madoka Magica will see the live action version; it's rated too high for kids to go see and looks too childish (at first glance) for average adult movie goers to want to go see it.

It'll end up a commercial flop. Which is what the producers will think.

If it ends up being made for the widest possible audience, it might at least make what it cost to make back at the box office... Which is what the producers really want.

Average people might like it, but Madoka fans (like you and me) wont.

I understand that trying to go for the biggest possible audience is important, but being accurate to the story is more important than anything else. A Hollywood Madoka would fail in trying to be all things to everyone, but a well-done and in line with Urobuchi's themes Hollywood Madoka could be a success. I would love to see Madoka and Gen Urobuchi become household names in America.

Personally, I think the only way to advertise a live-action Madoka Magica film to a general audience would be to not advertise it the way the anime was and to focus on the hope and despair aspect of it.

For example, if I was in charge of the look for promotional posters, I would have:
- One of Homura in Mitakihara City with a gun in her hand which is reaching towards her time-turner thing, as she hopelessly looks up at Walpurgisnacht.
- One of Sayaka battling against Elly (the witch from episode 4), showing the striking visuals of the witch scenes, with Elly's TV sets showing images such as Kyosuke in the hospital and Hitomi.

Both with slogans referencing the whole hope and despair thing. (Obviously there'd be a poster with Madoka on it but it's too hot for me to think any more xD).

Madoka Hollywood version from someone.

spoiler[I used to think that Madoka just couldn't work as a live action movie. At least not Hollywood live action, and I think it would have to be Hollywood to get the level of special effects you'd need.

But then I did some more thinking. Magical Girls aren't really that outside the American experience. There are actually only three changes that I think would have to be made to make it more palatable to American audiences.]

spoiler[ 1: Instead of making QB an alien without emotions trying to fight entropy, leave him as a more mysterious demonish figure. I don't think there is the need to explicitly make him the devil, but a devil type character in this type of story would fit Western sensibilities better. You don't need to change his personality at all, and could probably even leave him as an alien, but he couldn't be trying to fight entropy. Just leave it as his race feeding off of the girls despair somehow. (You already have him eating the grief seeds.)]

spoiler[ 2: At the ending, instead of Kyubee just granting Madoka's wish have him refuse. Have Kyubee point out all the costs and try to dissuade Madoka from making the wish. Have Madoka insist that this is her wish and that she will pay the price. Have a disembodied voice say "Granted" and then Madoka's wish is granted. Kyubee is thus never reconciled in the epilogue and is banished instead.

Essentially you would be heightening the Christian archetypes (which don't really damage the story since it's rooted in Faust and those very Christian archetypes). It also makes Kyubee a more explicit dark power that must be banished instead of subverted (which in this type of story is what Western audiences will expect and require).]

spoiler[ 3: This is the one I expect people to object to, but it's just the way things are. There would need to be a race lift on at least some of the characters.

American media tastes aren't nearly as racially driven as other cultures, but a movie with all Japanese characters when the plot makes no such requirement would be rather strange, particularly for the character of Madoka. Part of Madoka's symbolism is that of the typical normal white bread girl next door. And the truth of the matter, no matter how much we may object to it, is that in America white bread means white. To fully use the same symbolism in America, Madoka would have to be the generic blonde haired blue eyed white girl. (All visual characteristics associated with purity and innocence in American media). Might as well change her name to Mary while we are at it.]

spoiler[ Homura however, in both of her persona, actually goes very well with the American image of a Japanese/Asian girl. Thus I expect Homura would be left unchanged.

Mami of course being blonde and upper class would work very well with being white.

Hitomi is also upper class, but being a less important character it really doesn't matter that much what her race is.

Kyōko would be fun to keep as a redhead, but I think it might fit best to make her Black. It's obvious Kyoko comes from a family with a lower economic status, but in a very faithful and religious community that takes religious doctrine seriously. It fits with her background I think. Plus I think it would be more powerful for Kyoko to come from a different race than Sayaka. I think Madeline (with Maggie for short) would be the most fitting name for her.

That would leave Sayaka open to take the redhead slot- fitting with her personality and joining a long tradition of tomboy heroines. I think Deborah (Debbie) would be a good name for her.]

-------

At first I thought it would be nice to organize it into four short movies. Subtitled Mami, Sayaka, Kyoko, and Homura.

But after thinking about it I just can't see a way to effectively complete Sayaka's story without flowing into Kyoko's. So I think three movies would be best: Mami, Sayaka, and Homura.

1: Mami's movie I'm thinking would be around 100 minutes long, covering the events from episode 1 to the late-middle of episode 4 (ending about where spoiler[Sayaka is tempted by Kyubee while at the hospital)]. With an expansion around the following areas:

spoiler[ A: Add more to the background of Mami and let us know more about her.

B: As part of this add some further confrontations between Mami and Homura, more fully developing this aspect of the series. Make sure to add some scenes that will take on new meaning (preferably tragic) once it is revealed about Homura's nature and her past dealings with Mami.

C: Add in the fact that Mami knows Kyoko and that they are on semi-friendly terms (if possibly in disagreement about some matters). A possible way to bring this about would be to have Homura warn Mami about Walpurgis Night during one of their confrontations, and for Mami to write Kyoko about it asking for her help. (Which of course would be the main reason Homura warns Mami, is because Homura wants Kyoko around to help out in fighting it- although we won't realize this until later). This would also make it more poignant that Sayaka (who idolizes Mami) is fighting Kyoko who only showed up because Mami wrote her.

D: A minor note, but add a little scene to hint that Hitomi has feelings for Kyōsuke, but is restraining herself because of Sayaka's affections. It's be better if that didn't come out of nowhere.]

2: Sayaka's movie would tell both her story and Kyoko's and be around 120 to 130 minutes long. Covering events from the end of episode 4 through the end of episode 9. Expansion would be about:

spoiler[ A: Kyoko and Mami's backstory together.

B: Spend a little bit more time developing Sayaka's despair

C: A few more details about Homura and Kyoko's conversations, perhaps connected to Mami as well. I could see a scene where Kyoko wants to know who trained Homura (refusing to believe she didn't have a mentor) and Homura finally fingering Mami. If Mami in the previous movie had told Madoka and Sayaka that she didn't know Homura it would leave the audience in a state of speculation about why Homura claims to have been trained by Mami.

D: Just a small expansion on why Kyoko's father went mad and committed suicide. (Everyone always did what he said, every time he spoke people were deprived of their free will, he came to think that the devil was inside him and the only way to escape was death.)]

3: Homura's movie would be around 100 minutes long, covering episodes 10 to 12, with a major expansion of Homura's Backstory (doubling at least), and showing more of the alternate timelines.

Other changes to Hollywood: American names and no Kajiuran music.

[EDIT: Fixed your spoiler tag-placement and formatting to make your post legible. -TK]

bad idea. thats all i have to say

Yuki Kajura better return to score a hypothetical live-action movie. In fact, I've already decided that if anything I write is ever adapted, she's scoring it.

@bhl88 - Personally, I think Kyubey can be left as it is. The changes you suggested would undermine the whole point of the series - that Kyubey isn't evil; the despair the Magical Girls face is in direct relation to the distortion their wishes created. Kyubey is essentially a pure neutral, unable to understand or sympathise with the characters not due to any malice or ill intent, but because it simply cannot feel emotions.

Quote:

Kyōko would be fun to keep as a redhead, but I think it might fit best to make her Black. It's obvious Kyoko comes from a family with a lower economic status, but in a very faithful and religious community that takes religious doctrine seriously.

No.
Also, no fecking way is my bby Sayaka being renamed "Debbie" xD. If they are westernised, I'd hope that whoever localises the script actually takes care to look into the meanings of the character's names (and why they were given them) and chooses new names based on that, as opposed to random ones.

In terms of story progression, I think that it's perfectly fine to leave it as it is and it should be done in the same way as the anime movies: split into two parts, with the climax of the first movie focusing on spoiler[Sayaka's downfall], then the second movie on Madoka and Homura.

Honestly though, with how colour-coded Magical Girls tend to me, I imagine the costume designer will have a hard job. Madoka wouldn't realistically be able to have pink hair, nor Sayaka have blue, which are their main colour schemes.

bhl88 wrote:

Madoka Hollywood version from someone.

Kyōko would be fun to keep as a redhead, but I think it might fit best to make her Black. It's obvious Kyoko comes from a family with a lower economic status, but in a very faithful and religious community that takes religious doctrine seriously. It fits with her background I think.

I'd think Latina would fit an Americanized version of Kyouko better given the Catholicism.

I wouldn't be surprised if del Toro did executive produce a hypothetical Madoka Hollywood movie that the cast was mostly Latin-American(I think Mami would be the easier to accept as a white girl given her background and choice of weapon).

Personally from del Toro I'd not mind seeing, not a Madoka live action film, but his take on the Magical Girl genre & while also borrowing elements from Madoka.

Like with Pacific Rim i'd be all for some simple plot & dark atmosphere, such as 4-6 college students having to team up and fend off demons from destroying the planet, give them all distinguishable personalities & appearances, include plenty of nice battle scenes & maybe have some interesting chemistry going on between a few of the girls. c:

Last edited by bhl88 on Thu Aug 15, 2013 4:57 pm; edited 1 time in total

Kougeru wrote:

bad idea. thats all i have to say

Yes, it's a bad idea.

Ryu Shoji wrote:

@bhl88 - Personally, I think Kyubey can be left as it is. The changes you suggested would undermine the whole point of the series - that Kyubey isn't evil;

Ask the guy who made it on AnimeLove.

Kyoko's father: *probably from Texas in the Hollywood version or any other heavily red state*

Not even Del Toro can make a good live action version of Madoka Magica. I really loved Madoka Magica but it doesn't lend it self well to such a drastic medium shift like some other shows can. I guess hypothetically Del Toro could essentially borrow the same ideas for Madoka Magic and re-work them enough just as he borrowed concepts and ideas for Pacific Rim from works like Evangelion and a dozen other mech shows out there. I would actually see such a thing and I think that would be better idea than trying to adapt this show.

Kyubey also did spoiler[grant Madoka's wish, despite knowing that it would completely nullify the reason it wanted her to make a contract in the first place].

The base line to it is Kyubey is a pure neutral - a being with no emotions who simply sees things in the most rational sense. This rationale may come into conflict with human sensitivity, but there is no ill intent behind Kyubey. The only thing it ever did during the series that would be considered questionable is spoiler[lying to Kyoko about Sayaka, to get her out of the way to try and create a situation where Madoka would have to make a contract]. That was in fact, the only lie Kyubey made in the entire series and his reasoning to do so was perfectly justified from a mere logical standpoint - spoiler[Madoka defeating Walpurgisnacht and becoming a witch would supply a hell of a lot of energy to help stave off universal entropy] and even then, Kyubey's answer left it ambiguous.

I agree that something like this would completely undermine the message the series was giving...
Though a few corrections/elaborations (from someone who has seen the series 15 times through completely and the movies twice each... I might've overdone myself...):

1) spoiler[Kyuubey did not push Madoka and the others to make contracts directly... but he certainly took opportunities given to him to suggest that it was a good idea. For instance, he heavily pointed out that no one could come between Sayaka and Kyouko's fight except another Magical Girl... and that a potential magical girl was right there (hint-hint). And in episode 4, when Kyousuke was freaking out and Sayaka pointed out that miracles and magic did exist, guess who was right there to make sure her emotionally unstable self was put to good use. =P]

And 2) spoiler[Kyuubey never lied to Kyouko, though, like above, he definitely chose his words well to not discourage her from risking herself. Specifically, when Kyouko asked him if it was possible to turn a witch back into a magical girl, Kyuubey said something like, "Not to my knowledge" and "It's never been done before," but that it wouldn't surprise him if a Magical Girl, which defies even his reasoning, could somehow pull it off. Not a lie at all, but definitely one of his more devious lines, as if he was making sure to point out, "the possibility is not zero" and get her to try it out.]

Personally, I'd be EXTREMELY skeptical of an attempt to make Madoka live-action outside of Japan. Even with Del Toro. But I think the potential is there and, if the right kind of advertising and respect for the series itself and WHY it was so good was there, with heavy analysis as to why it all worked out how it did... I think it could be a potential hit. But the chances of this happening when the media formats are so different... is probably too low for it to work out so perfectly--especially for such a different audience, too.

Fair enough with both points. Actually helps concrete my point that Kyubey never did lie, just...it sure is an opportunist and knows the right moments to appear xD. The only real time Kyubey has tried to push anyone is when Madoka is directly involved though, which considering the potential she has, is understandable.

(And no, you haven't overdone yourself. I watched the 2 movies back to back and wanted to watch them again the very next day =3).

roseversailles wrote:

Gotta love del Toro.

The man's made some decent movies (and a really great one, in the form of Pan's Labyrinth), and he's an old school anime fan to boot. Pacific Rim was a fun watch, and personally I cannot wait to see what he does with Monster.

Not sure that Madoka would lend itself that well to live action (because, really, do any magical girl anime work live action? The costumes and special effects are a challenge, right off the bat), but if anyone were to attempt it, I think del Toro could find a way to make it work. Do I sense a project for 2016? Wink

Btw, the Madoka set is gorgeous. I've been drooling over mine the past week or so. Really curious to see what sort of package we get for the third movie, since it will have to be a separate set!

Agreed on Monster, and perhaps even Madoka.

Jave wrote:

Seems like a publicity stunt to get people to go see his movie in Japan by associating him up with a popular anime like Madoka Laughing

Hear! Hear!

This is the second publicity stunt they have made with del Toro. If Pacific Rim was the blockbuster it should have been, he would be the man to beg to make your favorite anime into a Hollywood live action flick, as it stands he will probably directing a lo budget artsy film next to regain the trust hollywood has in him so he can later on have a big budget film, that is IF hollywood does not start to move away of big budgets and returns to levels from 20 years ago.

I would think the art as a whole is too abstract to translate into a live-action film.

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